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Where Does it Happen
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ehsan elahi ehsan
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2005 2:35 pm    Post subject: Where Does it Happen Reply with quote

"Every thing, first of all, takes place into the mind of man'
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matt
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2005 10:06 pm    Post subject: Perception Reply with quote

Is that because we perceive it so, or because it is so? It's a good note you've put here.

To a social scientist a happening is an instance of communication. To a physicist it's motion. To a chemist it's a reaction. To a doctor it's collection after billing.

While watching hunters go off on a hunt I wondered how the deer perceived a successful hunt. Upon scratching a hunters eye, I wondered how the tree reacted.
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Clive
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 6:20 am    Post subject: We fail the human test Reply with quote

I hope that – if some maniac from my area (Calgary) decides to bomb a USA target that the USA wont bomb my country. It seems that a bag of lies have evolved in the BUSH admin and there would be no way for the truth to be known because the liars are telling us what the truth is…

I have a very low opinion of advertisers and the way they try to convince us that we are stupid and there for we must buy. It is the frog in a pot of water syndrome and if you turn the heat up slow enough you will cook the frog but if it where thrown in a pot of boiling water it would just jump out. Have we become to complacent to the worries of the world that if they are not on our door step.

I was in the supermarket the other day and I will tell you - I am a speed shopper and complete my business at break neck speed, but I paused to watch an elderly fellow comparing the price difference of 2 different cans of beans, the difference was 7 cents and it gave me the chills that some people after working all their lives have to look to save 7 cents, our respect for our elders has been lost in the western world, we forget that we will be elderly at some point and will be looking to save 7 cents on a can of beans.

We are a selfish world looking to make discussions based on what we get from it not the general good the opposite idea may represent – we fail daily to make the right decision because of selfishness.

For the life of me I can’t see why a man/women needs 100 million dollars or more and many in that position want more. A politician gets in to power to make a difference then he gets drunk with power and forgets his soul at the door of the legislature.

I heard that in sunny California that a new bylaw to stop people from having a snooze in public will come in to affect. So now the government wants to control the sleep of the very very poor… this is an attack on the homeless nothing less then disgraceful. It is hard to get a job but harder if you are of no fixed address. Strange, that a State that has as many millionaires have so many homelessness.

I believe that if people are not in a desperate situation they will not make desperate decisions.

Hate your next door neighbour but don’t forget to say grace… (Barry McGuire - Eve of Destruction)

At this point I will like to quit the Human race but that option is greyed out.
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ehsan elahi ehsan
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 12:58 am    Post subject: Where does it happen Reply with quote

If we want to imporve the conditions of this planet we will have to chalk out a positive plan in our minds first of all. All the goods and all the eveils generate from mind in the form of ideas. Then these ideas are put to practice and expressed through actions. Let us ponder deep what wrongs did we make to the human beings and how can we devise a peaceful and fruitful plan.
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Harry
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ehsan, if we were completely honest, we’d have to admit that we don’t know much about ourselves. We have little control over this planet or the people in it. The good Lord deliver me from any group of people who sit down and chalk out a positive plan to improve the conditions under which we live. It’s only a few short years ago we thought the earth was flat.
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ehsan elahi ehsan
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 9:25 am    Post subject: Where Does it Happen Reply with quote

Harry, do you mean man enters himself the ideas into his mind. I beg to differ with you.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ehsan

I simply mean we write our own questions and answer them. It is as simple as permitting a schoolboy to make up his final exam and mark the papers and pass himself with flying colors. We are the most self adulatory species on the planet.
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ehsan elahi ehsan
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 1:00 pm    Post subject: Whee Does it Happen Reply with quote

Harry, the question is of writing the question not of answering the question.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most people know the answer before they ask the question. That's the secret of success - they wouldn't accept an answer that didn't agree with their own.
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ehsan elahi ehsan
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 5:33 pm    Post subject: Where Does it Happen Reply with quote

Harry, what about the great ideas that have changed and can change the whoe concept of life. What about the great inventions made by man. What about the connection between hands and mind, I mean between the idea and the action, where do the questions take place, where do the answrs take place first of all. Where if the difference between between hope and hopelessness. Where do the wars take place, where does the peace reside first of all. From where did we get the idea of global reasoning, where did we suppose that by the idea we can improve the human relations,?????
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Harry
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 4:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All great questions, Ehsan... and I must admit I don't have the answer to any of them. My horizons are not nearly as broad as yours and when you ask, ("Where do the wars take place, where does the peace reside first of all?") I don't have to give you the answer. You've already made up your mind what the answer should be.

I've lived with war all my life. When I was little, ny mother took me out to watch the parade of men coming home from World War I. There were veterans there from both the Civil War and the Spanish American War. When I grew up I fought in my own war (WWII). I've seen nothing but war ever since. I have no reason to think that war is nothing more than a natural condition for the human species. Within my limited field of vision. war is all I've seen.
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Clive
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 6:39 am    Post subject: What we can do when we HAVE to Reply with quote

It was 7:00 am in the morning and after a night of minus 12 Celsius sleeping on a 4 foot sheet of ice my nephew and I emerge from a small Honda civic station wagon to witness a brilliant blue sky. It was shaping up to be a spectacular day.

My nephew and I started to work on our version of a roman ruin snow wall with an archway for fun. A gentle man of Scandinavian decent with a small wooden box opened it and showed me as many as 20 tiny bottles of liquors that we sampled at a ½ teaspoon per shot.

I watched a young child walking across the ice to the shore with his dog. The man with the box and I chatted as we sampled the flavours and the man would clean the glass with great care each time we sampled a shot. All of a sudden the man seemed to freeze and with a look of horror stared towards the shore. I turned quickly to view splashing from a hole in the ice where the young boy had been. I grabbed the rope off the hood of my car from where it had been placed after my nephew and I practiced throwing the rope and challenging each other to get the rope out as far as we could with out the back lash springing back.

I ran to the spot where the boy had gone through the ice and tossed the rope to him and it landed on his shoulder but he was too scared to grab it. I knew that I had little time if I where going to affect the out come of this event. I lay down on the ice and pulled my self to the boy just as I reached him the ice dissolved under me and sent me head first in to the icy waters of the lake. I could feel the boys coat as I went under and not wanting to take the boy with me and not wanting to let him go fearing the worst. I pushed the boy up to the surface of the water where he was grabbed and pulled to safety by one of the many man that came to the spot after hearing me alert them with my loud talk to the child and the rest of the lake. I pulled my self out of the water and said thank god he is ok.

What happened next was a unity of all the people on the ice that day. The mind set was changed from every one acting as independents to acting as a collective helping in any way they could. The people beside me that had little to say seem to come up with 5 gallons of split pea soup and a hot shower in their camper and the red necks from down the way came to me with Skidoo suits and boot so I could have dry cloth.

I guess the moral of the story is that when we are faced with tragedy we will pull together for the better good but it is a real shame that we cant feel like that with out the added adrenaline during an emergency. Acting as a collective is far more civilized then acting as independents with all our misunderstandings. In an emergency we do not have time to access the part of the brain that deals with our likes and dislikes or we use too much of the survival side and ignore the dislike section.


That day I witnessed what people could do when they had to.
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ehsan elahi ehsan
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most people know the answer before they ask the question. That's the secret of success - they wouldn't accept an answer that didn't agree with their own.
_________________I simply mean we write our own questions and answer them. It is as simple as permitting a schoolboy to make up his final exam and mark the papers and pass himself with flying colors. We are the most self adulatory species on the planet

Most people know the answer before they ask the question. That's the secret of success - they wouldn't accept an answer that didn't agree with their own.
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You've already made up your mind what the answer should be.

Harry, we need global reasoning. Thanks.
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Harry
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ehsan

You’re fond of quoting Shakespeare, so am I - (when it’s to my advantage).

“The fault, dear Brutus, is not in our stars, but in ourselves.”

“That for some vicious mole of nature in them,”

The first one is of course Cassius speaking to Brutus, the second is Hamlet speaking to Horatio at Elsinore. They were written from the same point of view, for much the same purpose and both of them hit the nail on the head.

It seems to me The United Nations, the League of Nations and the grand ententes of the nineteenth century were created for global reasoning - and why have they failed? It may well be that Shakespeare had the answer.

How do we get rid of that vicious mole?
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DaveR
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ehsan, the answer to Harry's question may be found if we examine the reasons for the failures of the United Nations.

Nice story Clive. If individuals and organizations could work together without thinking entirely about their own self interests the battle would be won, or at least well on the way to being won.
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ehsan elahi ehsan
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 3:26 pm    Post subject: Where does it happen Reply with quote

Harry , The League of Nations and the U.N.O. came to existence because their idea came to some body/bodies mind. They worked well becasue of global reasoning. The one failed and the other is going to fail because global reasoning was abandoned for ambition.
Thank you for quoting Shakespeare. He is always refreshening.
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ehsan elahi ehsan
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 5:43 pm    Post subject: Where Does it Happen Reply with quote

Clive, your narravtive is a fine illustration of the innate sympathy in man to help his fellew beings in crisis. The expression is forceful and convincing.
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Clive
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 5:01 am    Post subject: Rosa Parks Reply with quote

On December 1, 1955 a black women on a bus refused to give up her seat.
Rosa Parks was arrested and fined for violating a city ordinance.
This began the civil rights movement that ended the legal segregation of colours in the United States.

One woman that stood up for her rights by remaining seated - a worthy mention for this Forum.



From The Academy of Achievement

Rosa Parks Passed away last night peacefully in her sleep.

God bless you Rosa…


http://www.achievement.org/autodoc/page/par0bio-1
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

May you rest in peace, Rosa Parks. You stood for your rights and the rights of millions of others. You stood without being violent, but you faced the danger of great harm. You acted proud. You took action when reason was failing.
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ehsan elahi ehsan
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 1:31 pm    Post subject: Where does it take place Reply with quote

May you rest in peace Rosa. You reasoned out in your mind that it was proper to take action, you took action and succeeded.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We know that Rosa took action, but, Ehsan, do we know what went on in her mind? In a given situation, reasonable people will differ. Some reasonable people would have said it is improper to take action against the status quo.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 6:45 pm    Post subject: Where does it Happen Reply with quote

Rosa and 'the resonable' people both underwent the same process, though in different directions.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 8:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually Rosa Parks sparked the non-violent action civil rights movement in America. Non-violence was inspired by the actions of Ghandi, from your part of the world.

Sometimes reasonable people are outnumbered by non-reasonable people, and the reasonable course of action appears unreasonable.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 8:26 am    Post subject: Where does it Happen Reply with quote

DaveR, our proposition is that any thing we do, in the form of action or in the form of statement, does take place first of all in the mind. To be reasonable or unreasonbe is the later stage. Action comes after the mental process. This simply means that any thing great, if we want to do, will originate in our minds. To have the sources for the fulfilment of the idea is something to be arranged after that. I was talking about it in the context of the global reasoning. I know that we have no sources, physical or material or military etc but we can promulgated a good idea to the world to be cool minded, to stay for a while to think what is good for all the human beings. There may be millions of the people to support our idea. You have yourself given very good example of Gandhi. What sources he had against the British Empire when he thought of the non-violence movement.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 1:28 pm    Post subject: More CBC Reply with quote

We need a way to make the greedy, power hungry control freaks stop trying to make the world the property of a few individuals. For the life of me I cant see why a person worth a billion dollars want to set his alarm clock to get up early to go and try to get more (key word MORE). Perhaps a total economic crash causing WWIII, so we can have another chance to get off to a good start. We do not learn from history. Is the world over populated causing less in the kitty for share?

If we had a round table of wise men/woman to make discussions for the many they would become corrupt, because total power corrupts totally. Like the guy in a pizza shop eating a pizza with out permission cause he is making them…he makes a small one for him self no one will know… he becomes to think it is ok … Maybe later he borrows some cash from the till with the best of intention to return it and he does – till some where down the road he forgets then becomes accustom to borrowing and not having to return…

When ever a small amount of people control too much they will not have the best interests of the masses in their heart.

There is more then enough to go around but there are many that can’t get this help.
If food and money go to some countries in need the gangsters that rule the country/reign get it and use it as currency. How is this stopped…?

Now I am thinking of General Romeo Dellaire and his fight to call the battle between the Tutsi and Hutu’s genocide and how he watched and was not allowed to take action to stop obvious atrocity.

A Canadian hero…He tried and failed to communicate with the U.N. with his status as a General, so who do they listen to – not Dave R or Harry or I.


http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/dallaire/
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